Pastor's Circle - Mike Lueken

Mike Lueken, pastor of Oak Hills Church and author of Renovation of the Church, joined the Pastor's Circle to talk about how his church switched from being seeker-friendly to emphasizing spiritual formation.

Talk to us about your church. 

The church started back in 1984. It started as a typical church plant. There wasn't any planning about what we wanted to do.

In 2000...the decision was made to become a seeker-friendly church.

We went through the 90's as a seeker church.

We've had three significant shifts. One was when we started, then in the 90's when we decided to be a seeker church, and in the 2000's we became more focused on spiritual formation.

What didn't feel right? 

We had a couple of things coalesce around the same time. One of which I attended a doctoral class.

Through that my own heart got gripped with questions like what is the gospel?...does my church function appropriately?

Around the same time Kent (co-pastor) was feeling the same thing.

We went away on a retreat in the summer of 2000, and God spoke to us and told us to do something new.

What does a church look like that used to be seeker-sensitive, now discipleship-focused? 

We lost a ton of people. We lost approximately 1,000 people over the ten years we've been doing this.

We attempted to structure our church services around what people wanted.

When we started moving towards the idea of what is the gospel, it changed dynamics of our service...as a result they voted with their feet and left the church.

As an example, we would talk openly after we made this change about worship being what I want. And if I want is coming from the stage, I leave the room thinking it wasn't that great.

Maybe instead we should leave the room asking if we were good worshippers.

We started to emphasize over and over again what people have to do.

In general what we discovered was that there were a lot of people sitting in church, but they weren't interesting in being transformed. That was one of the eye-opening things.

As we began to change that...a lot of people woke up and decided that's not what they wanted to do.

Pastor's Circle - Daniel Ketchum

In today's Pastor's Circle: Daniel Ketchum, Director of Nazarene Missions International. Dr. Ketchum talked about the Middle East and how God is moving.

You just got back from a prayer journey to Israel. What's that all about? 

We rented a car and prayed over the country.

 

We were meeting with several leaders, including Israeli government leaders.

If something needs to happen in the Middle East, what needs to happen for the Gospel  to move? 

We were praying that the hearts of both Jews, Arabs, Palestinians, Muslims, and other hate groups that are all over that nation would have their hearts and minds opened...to come to a personal faith of Jesus Christ.

 

We were praying that there would be an alertness...that people would wake up and be ready for when Jesus comes a second time.

 

When Jesus comes again, he's not coming for salvation; he's coming to gather those who believe in Him.

I fear we begin to mock the possibility that Jesus will come again. Do people around the world still yearn for the second coming? 

Oh, those a readiness that the Holy Spirit is pouring out. It's a gift of God to long and desire for the King to come back.

 

We're hearing stories and knowing people in Muslim faith, in Hindu faith, in Jewish faith who are seeing visions of Jesus.

 

He Himself is actually evangelizing the nations.

 

There is a longing and a readiness for the return of Christ.

One of the ways Christ works is through dreams. How does that work?  

Let me tell you one story, Matt.

 

A young man whom we actually met at a Bible College...his name is Ali, I won't mention his last name for security reasons.

 

He heard about Jesus when he was just a boy...but Jesus appeared to him when he was just six-years-old in a dream and said. "I am Jesus, the son of the living God, and I love your and your family."

 

He had learned he was supposed to resist Jesus.

 

When he was twelve, someone gave him a copy of the New Testament...he hid it.

 

He realized that this Jesus in the New Testament was the same Jesus who appeared to him.

 

He became aware that there was a denomination that had a school in Europe.

 

He wanted to go back to the Muslim world and share Jesus...that's what he's doing today.

Pastor's Circle - Sam Shaw

Sam Shaw has been a pastor for years. Nine months ago he planted the Orchard Fellowship, a church in Memphis, TN. Since he's still in the throes of the church planting process, he answered questions about his experience.

 

What are the keys to making a church plant work? 

One is that you work as a part of a team.

 

If you plant a church, you form a team.

 

I think also maintaining your walk with Christ, the spiritual disciplines.

 

That seems to be the first thing that goes by the wayside.

 

Another thing that comes to mind is that there will be a constant parade coming through...so it's critical to define the church.

As a church planter you have to be buoyant and resilient. This whole self encouragement thing is tough, isn't it?

I was pastor at another church where we planted 106 churches.

 

We looked for people who are self-starters...they had something from the inside that was drawing them up and out.

 

Also, you have to like people and believe what God is doing in people.

What's the philsoophy of The Orchard about membership? 

We ask people who are going to be a part of the church...you have to make certain commitments.

 

To be a giver.

 

To be involved

 

To be a server.

 

We don't ask people to agree to tithe...but we do ask people to be generous and faithful givers.

 

Membership...means actually I'm going to be involved.

Does having high expectations help a church? 

Studies show that churches with high demands...people rise to those expectations.

 

There is something about a high demand church that shows seriousness.

Do we need more than just regular church plants?

We have to have missional church plants.

 

We're involved with a failing Memphis school.

 

We've been able to do such things as renovate teacherrs' lounges, bought a new copier...redone the flower beds.

 

We're seeing some people from that school actually joining the church.

What kind of damage do you do to people's souls when you have a church that doesn't have a heart for the hurting? 

I think you reduce the glory of God.

 

I think you give a reduced image of the Gospel.

 

At many churches it seems the expectations are so very low.

As a church planter, what are the biggest problems you're facing? 

My wife broke her leg. I've been caring for her for the past three months.

 

So my time, in terms of serving in the church, has been greatly impacted.

 

We've had problems with leadership.

 

All of those firsts that take place...those are all exciting, but require a tremendous amount of work and thought.

 

And also putting in place the structure of the church, the polity of the church

Pastor's Circle - Albert Haase

Father Albert Hasse, a Franciscan priest, came into the Pastor's Circle to explain why Pentecost is, unfortunately, often overlooked by the church. Learn more about Fr. Haase here.

In those days when they go to Jerusalem and wait, was that an emptying process?

Well, you could certainly interpret it that way.

In so many ways Pentecost is the birthday of the church.

You hit the nail right on the head...I think you are dead right. That is, we do not give Pentecost the kind of importance it should have.

Not only do we not give Pentecost its importance, but we also forget that we share in that gift of the Holy Spirit.

Why don't we pay enough attention to Pentecost?

I think part of the reason might be that we love to bask in the glow of Christmas, because it reminds us of God's love for us.

We love to bask in the glow of Easter, because it marks the defeat of the devil.

But Pentecost requires something from us.

I think part of the reason why we have not paid attention to Pentecost, and given it its important, is because deep down we realize that it comes with a challenge.

We need to reclaim the fact that Pentecost is the birthday of the church and now as a results we have a work to do.

Is servant leadership an appropriate thought for us?

Oh, absolutely, because in so many ways that's what it's all about.

It's interesting that this whole idea of servant leadership actually got started in the Christian millieu and then moved out into corporate America.

I think that people are now beginning to realize that (washing feet) requires strength.

In the Gospel of John when he gets down to wash the feet of his disciples, he really shows himself as a servant leader.

How important is it to continually open up leadership pathways for younger people?

If we 're going to survive as the community of Jesus, we don't have much of a choice.

As long as we stay in touch with the spirit, the spirit will enlighten us.

What makes that hard for us old geezers?

Oh, come on, you know as well as I do, Matt. We don't want to let go of our pulpit.

The best churches I've seen are the ones where pastors who don't own their pulpits.

In Acts the Spirit raised leaders up, the Spirit is trying to do the same doggone thing today.

Ministry Spotlight: Kristine Ruggles - Christ Clinic

Christ Clinic, which offers affordable medical care to the poor, is located in Spokane, Washington. 

Your mission statement is "Healing the body, healing the soul." What exactly are you doing there in Washington?

We were founded by four physicians who came back to Spokane after being  out in the mission field and realized we had just as much need here.   Now, twenty years later, we are serving about a 6,000 patient pool.  We provide excellent medical care as well as counseling and spiritual counseling.

Do you feel that some people come through that have their lives spiritually altered?

Absolutely. I had  a patient sit down with me the other day and tell me how our clinic helped to change her life.  She lost her husband, she lost her job, so she originally came to us just for medical care, and ended up receiving spiritual comfort.

Does it bother you that some people might be taking advantage of you?

I would say no. We welcome anyone who comes in through our doors. It is Christ and the hands of Christ who provide this care to them.  

We're not going to concern ourselves with the few that may take advantage of it.

Are you tied to any churches?

No. We do have a sister ministry, however. Our original counselor felt called by God to really go deeper, particularly with the women.  

Christ's Kitchen was started to help the women hear and study the Word of God.

Why do these doctors and nurses do this instead of something financially 

The positions are all volunteer. The practitioners that we have are all working on missionary wages. They're doing it because it's the call of God.  

We feel seriously that we are to care for the poor, share our food, and provide medical care.
We have lots of clients who are really trying to make it but simply can't because of their low-paying jobs. 

We're there as a safety net for them.

Is this their full time job?

No. Many of them have their own practices. This is what they do on a volunteer basis.  

Some of them work one afternoon a week, some work one a month. They give whatever they can.

Is this ministry the kind of thing that could happen anywhere?

Absolutely. In any major urban area. But it takes the utmost commitment of your Christian walk and your heart.  

I think if our founders could have seen the future, they may not have ever begun. They just took that leap of faith and walked step by step with the lord.

What is the biggest problem in Spokane? How can we pray for you?

We really need prayer to be able to continue the battle. A lot of our patients have lost all hope. They aren't taking care of themselves. They don't have a relationship with Christ.  

That can weigh heavily on the staff, to have to carry that burden day in and day out.  So prayer for our staff would be appreciated.

Pastor's Circle - Steve Blakemore

Dr. Steve Blakemore, Professor of Philosophy at Wesley Biblical Seminary and Director of Third Millennium Faith, addressed the now-failed prediction that Jesus would return on May 21st as well as how we should view the second coming.

What should be our attitude towards the second coming? 

Well, it should be the source of our great hope.

We should have a great hope in awaiting Jesus to come and complete the redemption that he has begun.

The doctrine of the second coming...is a reminder to us that we can't create the kingdom of God in this world...God ultimately will have to complete what he started in Jesus.

We should be living for the sake of others - that Jesus wants to bring them into the glory of His kingdom too. 

You didn't hear a lot of people expressing hope that Jesus would come back this weekend (as predicted).  Do we really look forward to the second coming?  Do we in the West have too much affluence to want Him to interrupt all that? 

You know what? I think you have really, right there in that, struck upon a great insight that Christians in the west for decades and centuries have been blessed with such affluence.

Let's face it, the early church's prayer "even so, Lord Jesus, come quickly" was said in a culture where many people wanted to kill them. 

What does it tell us about a culture that doesn't yearn for the return of Jesus? 

I think first of all it tells us the church may not really be living for the triune God and the glory of the Savior of the world.

If we can get the comfort and blessing right now, we may not want Jesus to come and interrupt the comfort.

If we're living for our own satisfaction, we're not worrying about the salvation of the whole world.

So we're not driven to glorify Him nor are we oriented so we can see the redemption of the whole world.

 It's got to say something about the shallowness of our faith. 

I do think it does indeed. Our faith is so individualized...our faith is so focused on what God can give me right here and now that we forget the calling of Jesus is not come to Him and be blessed. The call of Jesus is to come follow Him.

When someone was in need they sold it and gave it. Even in that, the early church was such that they said, "If Jesus can use our stuff, we're not going to hold on to it."

I think it does say something about the shallowness, because we're so focused on personal welfare.

I have an email here from a lady who wants to start a mass prayer to protect against the great tornado outbreak. Is that an appropriate kind of prayer? 

I would say yes.

Because we're to cry out to him and cast our every care upon the Lord. We don't just need spiritual blessings, we don't just need moral blessings...

But I think in light of this we need to remember something that's easy for us to forget in our technological age, we're not really in control. 

Pastor's Circle - Jerry Horner

Jerry Horner joined the Pastor's Circle today, sharing how the Apostle Paul has had an impact on his life.


Who are some Bible characters - outside of Jesus - who have provided inspiration to you?

If I had to pick one outside of the Lord, of course, it would have to be the apostle Paul.

I supposed Paul has been my mentor. Here's a man who was in rebellion...here was a champion of the traditional way.

I felt myself to be a traditional champion of the faith. But when God opened my eyes to the scripture, I saw that I was wrong on many fronts.

Here was Paul on the way to Damascus.

As far as he was concerned Jesus was dead.

He was not too big to admit his mistakes. When he and Barnabas had this dispute about John Mark...later Paul admitted that he was wrong. Paul was not too big to recognize his own mortality. He was not too big to recognize that he needed people's prayers.

Why did God call Paul?

Paul had a reputation - a terrible reputation. So much so that when he did leave Jerusalem, nobody wanted to have anything to do with him.

I think that the apostle's would have been comfortable in Jerusalem and in Judea until one thing happened. Stephen's martyrdom and the accompanying persecution.

Paul did set things into motion for the worldwide spread of the gospel.

One of the things we've got to learn from Paul is you're going to have some suffering in you life.

You know what, the Lord himself said that.

I'm all for stressing the benefits of discipleship...but I want to tell you, let's not leave out commitment. Let's not leave out the lordship of Jesus Christ. Anyone who's going to pattern his life after the Lord Jesus Christ is going to face persecution.

Looking back in Christian history, who would be your heroes?

There have been many who I've looked towards.

I look to a man by the name of Charles Spurgeon as a model preacher, as an expositor of the gospel.

When I was in seminary, I bought a set of commentaries...one of the best investments I ever made was when I traded those books for a set of Spurgeon sermons.

Why was he so great?

We can praise God that somebody had enough foresight to take down notes and devised some kind of shorthand to preserve those sermons.

I think what made him so terrific was his commitment ot the word of God...and this man had a way of bringing out the word of God to the situation he was addressing.

How can we be the kind of speakers who were relevant like Spurgeon?

I think it's very simple. First, make reading the newspaper a daily habit.Read the newspaper and read the Bible.

Stay abreast, know what is happening.

In every particular country that I'm in, I have to be relevant to what they're going through.

Author: Drew Dyck, "Generation Ex-Christian"

Drew Dyck is the author of "Generation Ex-Christian," a book dealing with the mass exodus of young adults from the church.

Apparently a lot of young people aren't attracted to local churches. Why this generation more than others?

I think it  starts with taking a look in the mirror. Often the problem lies with us.
The way we do youth ministry is to see how many kids we can get through the door on a Friday night and keep entertained. 

I saw a statistic that said 65% of young adults in this country  have at some point made a decision for Jesus.
We've done an excellent job getting them through the door, signing the card, saying the prayer, but we've done a poor job following through. 

It starts in the home. A lot of parents have this idea that they can take their kids to youth group and the professionals will do their job.
That's so wrong. What happens at church can't make up for what happens 24/7 at home. 

I tell parents who are concerned about their kids walking away not to wring their hands about it if their own faith isn't vibrant. It's hard to expect the kids to do something that the parents didn't model for them.

When talking about church, and youth groups in particular, did we once do it better?

We did, actually. The reason the whole youth ministry movement started was for biblical education.
Now it's more about pizza and video games. 

If our strategy is to out-entertain the world, we've settled for a tragic replacement for biblical education and the kind of Christianity that changes the world.

In my interviews, I was surprised to find that youth groups were thought of positively. I got comments like, "I loved my youth group! It was so much fun!" We entertain without informing.

 Why are young adults so hostile towards the church?

I tried to identify some themes that emerged during my interviews. A lot of people cite intellectual problems with the faith, but there are underlying experiences that moved them to walk away. \

For instance, I spoke with one girl who talked for an hour about her intellectual case against God. As I was finishing up the interview, asking her a few more questions, it came out that she had been betrayed at a Christian school by Christian friends. 

Many times intellectual doubt are just a smokescreen for previous negative experiences.

Ministry Spotlight - New Horizons Ministries

New Horizons Ministries, run by Loren and Dolores Miller, is located in Canon City, Colorado. Their mission statement is, "Providing Christ-centered nurture for children and families in need." The Matt Friedeman Show today featured Loren telling us what his ministry offers.


Talk to us about what you're doing in Colorado.

The vision was birthed when we found out that moms who go to prison pregnant have no possibility to have a life with their child after release. 

So we just started taking children into our home.

How did you get that opportunity?

We were interested in prison ministry, and we were contacted by a prison chaplain and notified that there was a need. That's how it started.

So you take these babies, and raise them until their mothers get out of prison?

That's right. 

We take them into our homes, provide the best childcare, we provide one worker per child. They are with that child all the time, supervised by a house parent. Every week, we take them in for a 2.5 hour visit with their moms.

How many homes do you have right now that are taking in these kids?

About five. We can take in from 15 to 20 kids at one time.

Talk to us about a success story you've had with both mother and child.

I didn't realize taking care of a child would open the heart of a woman wide to the gospel. 

Once they are out, we have programs for reintegration and recover, to help them move forward. Once we see a mom  has been in the rehab program for six months, we'll provide her a job, and then she can begin her life again. 

The moms who are willing to accept personal responsibility have phenomenal success.

What is your success rate?

94% of our children were united with their families. 

The first child we took was in 1992. It was life changing for them. What they needed was someone to show them the way, and to walk with them. 

There's a huge desire among our staff to use this time in their lives to make a real difference. There are many youth today that really want to grab onto something that will impact their personal life while they are impacting others.

When you get out of prison, you have to have a good recovery group and a job. Right?

Absolutely. If the ladies don't have that, they'll just turn back to their old life.

Pastor's Circle - Rick Scarborough

On your website, visionamerica.us you have a sermon  "The High Cost of Low Living." Talk to us about what that means, especially when you apply it to, say, Newt Gingrich.

First you have to worry about the pastors and spiritual leaders who signed on with the Gingrich campaign and endorsed it.

I once had the opportunity to sit down and talk with Newt in his office with another pastor, and to ask him about his walk with God.

I truly believed him to be a great man of God, only to find out later that there was a young, attractive woman down the hall who was then engaged in an extramarital affair with him.

So something to remember is that someone can look you in the eye, talk Christianity, and be involved in great sin.

In fact, no one talked about his faith more clearly and concisely in the 2008 elections than Barack Obama.There's also another issue that everyone needs to be praying about.

There is no visible leader among the evangelical community. There's no leader of the pastors, and there's no leader of the politicians.

There are two forces that pastors can be influenced by. The lust for things and the temptations that come from money cripple ministry.

The second force is fear. I had to repent and spend more time listening to God than I did listening to talk radio and television commentators.

How do we protect ourselves?

There's a story in Luke 2 about Jesus getting lost in Jerusalem. His parents realize it and search the city frantically, only to go back and find him in his Father's house. 

In the same way, if we're drifting, we can go back and see where God was blessing, where God's presence was tangible, where we had great quiet times.

How important is that daily time of prayer and Bible study?

As important as eating and sleeping. 

It is the daily sustenance for the follower of God.

Pastor's Circle - Joseph Parker

How important is discipleship to the Church?
I think it's very helpful for us to see Matthew 28 as being a job description for the Church.
It teaches us the priorities in our lives. It's important to walk out the agenda of the Word and the Holy Spirit as found in the Bible.

Describe a disciple.
When we think of the twelve disciples, we remember that they walked, learned, and followed in the footsteps of Jesus. That's a good example of what we need to be doing. Another good example of what a disciple should be is found in Luke 10, when Mary was sitting at Jesus' feet and hearing his words. That is what every Christian is called to do: to hear his word and live it out.
"Hearken" is a good word. It means to hear in order to do. A lot of times in churches we do a good job hearing, but we don't go and do. The Great Commission points out that the high calling of every believer is to help others to know the Lord.

When Jesus said "Follow me" to his disciples, he not only taught, but he went out and did. It's not merely evangelizing, but also a life of compassion.
Obedience encompasses so much. Not only beginning to share the gospel, but also walking out the love of God.
John 21 carries the story of Peter being reinstated into the disciples. Jesus asks him three times, "Do you love me?" And every time Peter says he does, Jesus replies, "Feed my sheep."
We are to live a life of compassion and love and mercy. A faithful disciple is going to be aggressive in his lifestyle following after Jesus, not passive.

What's the best way to make disciples in local church?
Disciple our families in the home to begin with, and then carry that into the church.
Fathers and mothers who pray and disciple their children are vital to the life of the body.

Pastor's Circle - Gill McKee

Gil McKee, Senior Pastor of the First Baptist Church of Tuscaloosa, was on the show today, discussing the recent tornadoes and their impact on Tuscaloosa.


We understand y'all got hit hard by this tornado in Tuscaloosa.

We did, Matt.

About 6,000 homes and businesses destroyed. Of course, the worst statistic is that we had 41 confirmed dead here in Tuscaloosa.

There wasn't a whole lot you could do about it.

That's really true.

All you can do is take cover in a basement or somewhere you think you can be safe.

What are the kinds of things you've been talking to your people about?

Well obviously the questions on people's minds after any crisis is, "why?"

We were fortunate that our church wasn't impacted at all. We had no death and no injuries that we know of.

If you travel around this city and look at all the areas, there's just no way you can believe only 41 people were killed.

God's hand was here, he was protecting folk.

I think we're seeing a revival in our community.

It's a perennial question, but why do bad things happen to good people?

I don't think any of us are immune. We're living in a world that's a sinful place.

Just because we're Christians doesn't mean we're always out of the path of danger or bad things that take place. I think we have to understand that while we're in this world we're not immune to these things, but we go through this with the understanding that God is with us.

The scripture is clear that we're going to face difficulty and persecution.

What I found in my own life, it's during the difficult times that we really grow the most.

If things were always good, I don't think we'd understand our need for God.

What  fresh things are you telling graduates?

We had senior graduation recognition Sunday yesterday for our high school graduates.

One of the things we see here because of the university, I guess. Young people are going to go out and taste the oats, so to speak, they're going to go out and experiment.

Our youth pastor told them that they didn't have to do that.

While it's not particularly fresh, Matt, I think our kids need to hear that you don't have to do all of that.

Over the next four and five years, they're going to make some of the most critical decisions of their entire life. So, how can you make those decisions and not be close to God.

What do I tell a bunch of graduate students about evangelism?

I don't think I can teach you anything about it.

Evangelism is a lifestyle of living Christ in an authentic way day in and day out.

Brain Trust - Janice Crouse

Janice Crouse, Senior Fellow at the Beverly LaHaye Institute, is a strong voice for traditional family values. Today on the Matt Friedeman Show she talked about the importance of marriage. 

Is marriage an institution of suffering?

No, that's not true. It just blows my mind, Matt, to see how liberals will make up information.

The truth of the matter is says that married people are healthier, happier, and they have better sex.

What can the Church do?

Well number one, I think the Church has to support marriage.

You very seldom hear sermons talking about the importance of marriage.

It really troubles me to see so many young people buying into the Cameron Diaz line that marriage is no longer needed.

I'd like to see the Church send a very strong message that way.

I would like to see more emphasis on the benefits of marriage and the importance of marriage in strengthening the country.

It's a very important public benefit as well as private benefit.

We need to tell people that marriage isn't about you.

It's time for us as Church members to say...that when you behave in a way to betray Christ, you are a reflection not only on yourself and your own family, you're a reflection on the Church as well.

I think we need to bring that dimension into how people conduct their lives. It's not just a private matter, it affects how people view Jesus Christ.

I've always been interested to see that the divorced people like sermons about marriage.

There are studies that show couples who are on the brink of divorce, but decide not to, find out five years later that their marriage is stronger than before.

So often people divorce in a hurry and now with no-fault divorce, they don't have time to think through their choice.

I'm not surprised that divorced people respond so well to your message.

Pastor's Circle - Darryl Starnes

Darryl Starnes, Bishop for the AME Zion Church, joined the show today to address the issue of what the Church can do to combat the moral decay plaguing our nation.

How is it that a nation descends into a moral black hole?

Well, I think history has always proven that countries go through these cycles.

We may have a period of revival and morality...sensitivity to the things of God cause people to live on a higher moral plain. But then as generations come up...we have a tendency to have this happen.

It provides an opportunity for fresh ministry, a fresh opportunity to share Christ.

Are there challenges that we have today that other cultures haven't had?

When we say challenges unique to us, it's just unique for us in recent time. For a while, we've enjoyed what I call homecourt advantage.

Now, in this multicultural society where anything goes, we may not have that homecourt advantage, but we're more like the 1st century.

In one way it's disheartening. In another way it's exciting.

How are churches impacting their culture?

The greatest way I think is the way we live in the day to day walk of live as people interact with us.

Our worship services are very important, but if there's not a connection between Sunday morning and what we are in the week, there's something wrong.

Whose fault is it? Is it the church's fault?

I think that there's room for all of us in terms of fault. But when I look at a situation, I want to know, what am I going to be accountable to God for, what is He going to ask me about?

So I think that again, if we focus on how we can be that salt and that light...that is a good focus, that we look at ourselves.

How many churches are really being Salt and Light?

I'm not certain about how many churches, but I do believe that most churches have some people who truly are hungry and thirsty for righteousness.

The churches that have more of those people are the ones who cannot only make a difference as  individual Christians, but can make a difference as a faith community.

Do you see the small 'platoons' as the means of social change?

I really do.

I believe that when that small group accountability is authentic, it moves us outside of ourselves.

I believe that as we have that quality time with God, it will move us outwards. In the same way, God will move that small group outward.

What would you say to church leaders who want to turn moral decay around?

I would say that the most important thing we must do as pastors and church leaders is first of all to identity in the congregation those lay leaders who really have a heart for God. And really pour himself into those people.

I think we have to identify leaders, pour ourselves into them, then unleash them as change in society and the church.

Pastor's Circle - Chuck Huckaby

Chuck Huckaby, Pastor of St. Andrew's Church, joined us today to talk about catechisms and their importance to the faith. 

Catechisms. What are they? Why are they important?

The word catechism comes from a Greek word about passing on knowledge from my mouth to a disciple.

Pretty much every evangelical protestant church you can find in the United States has a catechism.

If you dig around in your church's bookshelves...you might find a catechism.

As a pastor my job, and your job...as we oversee the teaching ministry of the church, our job is to make sure that everyone who comes to the church is at least exposed to the basics.

In Second Timothy 2:2 - how are we going to pass on the truth to the next generation? 

Why has it fallen out of favor?

Well, I guess we just like new experiences all the time.

We want this sense that we're getting new information all the time.

If you're memorizing the Heidelberg catechism, when hard times hits, what is the comfort? That's where an answer comes in. 

Even Baptists have a catechism!

Absolutely.

There's more than you'd ever imagine.

The people who don't think they use catechisms, you dig around, they're probably there.

If you were going to seek a Catechism revival, any recommendations?

If people just look in their theological tradition, they will find catechisms that will help establish a strong foundation.

John Rosemond on Self-esteem

Parenting expert John Rosemond is an author, speaker, and columnist who takes a counter-cultural and common-sense approach to parenting. You can find Rosemond's work at his website.

On the Matt Friedeman Show, Rosemond talked about the fallacy of the self-esteem movement.  

You don't like the self esteem movement.

I don't like the self-esteem movement.

The research indicates that high self-esteem is linked with low respect of others.

Then, from the biblical perspective, there is nowhere we can justify that thinking of ourselves highly is a worthy pursuit.

So this is not just a new Testament concept as well.

We need especially in the Christian community to understand that this high self-esteem movement got it's start in the 1960's.

Who started it?

The serpent started it.

I don't believe in psychology....I do believe that many of the messages that come out of psychology...are the will of the serpent.

We entered the 1960's one American and we exited the 1960's another America.

All of this has failed. One of the interesting exercises I do before my audiences is I ask, "how many of you think high self-esteem is important for children to have?"

Then I ask, "Would you rather live next door to a person who has high self-esteem or one who's humble and modest?"

In each relationship, everybody agrees they would rather be in a relationship with someone who's humble and modest.

You said that growing up, you were often put in your place.

Absolutely.

When I acted like it was all about me, my mom said, "You're getting a little too big for your britches. You either size them to yourself or I'll size them to you."

High self esteem has done no one any favors. And it has certainly not done America any favors.

You say that self-esteem fuels entitlement.

One of the ways this was sold to America was the idea that it would help people perform better.

People with high self-esteem perform below level.

Today's teachers tell me that students are satisfied with mediocre performance.

This is what today's employers tell me.  They too believe that mediocrity has become  okay in the work place.

Pastor's Circle - Chris Lohrstorfer

Today in the Pastor's Circle: Chris Lohrstorfer, Senior Pastor of Hinds Independent Methodist Church, talking about grace, works, and a personal relationship with God. 

Do people ever operate as Christians without having a personal relationship with God?

It happens a lot.

The thing is, you ended your devotion time talking about works. The problem is most people work like they're in a pre-Pentecost church instead of a post-Pentecost church.

They're not really experiencing God and letting that flow over into their life.  They are working for God and not with God. 

 
How refreshing is it when you're working with God?

It's freeing. It's not the kind of work that you do to gain something.

It frees you up from a kind of slavery. It just allows life to be about living out the gospel.

 
How can someone know what to do to get that personal relationship?

I think first of all, Acts chapter 1, Jesus said wait for it.

The waiting for it involves confession, surrender.

You have to follow through with that, because you're not going to meet with Him outside of grace.

Wait, confessing, surrendering, receiving from Him.

 
Do we have to groan after this experience?

Well, that is the debate of the day, I suppose.  John Wesley always said wait for it.

I think he's right about that.

In my own experience, we want to tell God what to do...to really experience it, it's gotta happen on God's timing.

You can confess it all you want. But it's not a confession; it's a possession.

  What does it mean to "groan after"?

You've gotta want it.  It's not like God's holding you out on a string.

I think this groaning after is a person who wants it more than all other things.

I think when you want it to the place that you're ready to hang on and experience it, that's probably the groaning after.

Just wanting a deeper work of the Spirit to happen this Sunday doesn't mean it will necessarily happen?

Sometimes we just want to wait for that emotional tickle. God doesn't want to tickle you. He wants to change you.

You have to get past the emotional.

 How can you reach God personally through prayer?

I think the Church makes a huge mistake in prayer.

We turn it into telling God what to do.

Rather than letting prayer be anthropocentric, why not let prayer come from God?

I think that's the key. I'm talking about the Holy Spirit guiding your heart and mind in prayer.

 How do we approach a personal God through scripture?

Take a book of scripture. Read and study through it.

You have to be able to meditate on scripture.

Use that time and strengthen God's will in your life.